tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post1321449904391538257..comments2024-03-28T11:29:46.845-07:00Comments on Whole Health Source: Beyond Ötzi: European Evolutionary History and its Relevance to Diet. Part IStephan Guyenethttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09218114625524777250noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-65357068137339257172012-05-08T08:07:31.679-07:002012-05-08T08:07:31.679-07:00All of these assumptions totally negate the fact t...All of these assumptions totally negate the fact that the gut flora is part of the digestive system. The traditional humans weren't as excessively clean and when they ate, they ate the bacteria that possessed the enzymes to digest a particular 'food' that people above are claiming these traditional people do not have a genetic pre-disposition to. There is a reason why fermented dairy product would create less issues for a person than non-fermented.<br /><br />Also, the same genetic pattern can express itself differently depending upon the tissue or environment. To correlate these alleged genetic 'signatures' with food toleraces seems to be a stretch of imagination. Things tend to sound more impressive when you classify them in scientific terms, but classifying something in this terminology doesn't make it truth or more impressive for that matter.Asimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12680880808056066311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-44600349103640687962012-05-07T15:47:02.764-07:002012-05-07T15:47:02.764-07:00@don: the reason you have problems growing things ...@don: the reason you have problems growing things is you are using delicate plants. Blueberries, blackberries, oaks and other nut-bearing trees grow NATURALLY. As for squirrels being easy to catch, that is because you aren't hunting them regularly. Start trying to live off the wild game and suddenly the wild game becomes quiet scarce. Trapping is easy for a very short while, then you exhaust the game and it isn't so easy anymore unless you have unlimited amounts of land at your disposal. Regarding birds, again, this is because you are talking about delicate plants. Wild grains grow naturally. For example, the American indians harvested natural wild rice. Birds are a competitor for wild rice, so why didn't the birds eat it all up? Because, unlike humans, birds can't harvest and store a year's worth of food at once. All they can do is migrate from feeding ground to feeding ground, and inevitably this leaves lots of areas underutilized. And they learn quickly that humans can shoot arrows and thus tend to avoid anyplace that has humans present. The net result is that humans can typically grab a substantial proportion of any plant food they want, in most places of the world, regardless of competition from birds or other animals. <br /><br />There are only two situations where hunting is easy. The first is when there is a low supply of other humans, since humans can usually wipe out the other top predators (using dogs and weapons). That's when hunting and trapping is easy. However, within a very short period of time, human population will rise to where either humans are limited by starvation (same limit as is imposed on other top predators) or the humans will turn to eating plants. <br /><br />The second situation is one where no top predator is able to be very successful and thus there is always a surplus of prey. The sea fits this description. Before modern times, the sea always had an essentially unlimited supply of fish. The limiting factor was the danger of the fisherman lifestyle. For whatever reason, other ocean top predators (big sharks, killer whales) were never abundant enough to make a dent in the vast supply of prey fishes.frhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14980384436598923074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-50666728668494185272012-05-05T08:30:09.016-07:002012-05-05T08:30:09.016-07:00You have got very nice and interesting blog ;) Her...You have got very nice and interesting blog ;) Here is link to my blog ;) http://www.eplws.blogspot.com/Ellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03156441294650446810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-19163632122369287272012-05-04T22:57:01.159-07:002012-05-04T22:57:01.159-07:00This is a great blog posting and very useful,thank...This is a great blog posting and very useful,thank you so much for sharing this post.<br /><br /><a href="http://efitnessjournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Fitness Journal</a><br /><a href="http://efitnessjournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Online Fitness Journal</a>Amarjeet Prasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18435833890412140631noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-5362558091580156442012-05-04T22:54:36.880-07:002012-05-04T22:54:36.880-07:00Thank you for ur information,I really like it .
...Thank you for ur information,I really like it . <br /><br /><a href="http://efitnessjournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Fitness Journal</a><br /><a href="http://efitnessjournal.com/" rel="nofollow">Online Fitness Journal</a>Amarjeet Prasadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18435833890412140631noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-53143779890697082102012-05-04T11:35:03.532-07:002012-05-04T11:35:03.532-07:00No doubt your blog is very good, please help me in...No doubt your blog is very good, please help me in improving my blog which i made for the same reason, you can also help me in improving the post and navigation structure improvement, the best and the most important assitance you can do is improving me in developing my content, you can recommend me some online resources also, please take a look at my work http://www.islam-health.comAshar Kashmirihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11649142190663336313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-46678894086830334522012-05-04T01:35:42.520-07:002012-05-04T01:35:42.520-07:00So when did these middle eastern immigrants start ...So when did these middle eastern immigrants start relying heavily on agriculture?<br /> <br /><br />http://ccchatt.blogspot.com/x1rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14514928229233307057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-18511770826811914672012-05-03T07:09:59.594-07:002012-05-03T07:09:59.594-07:00I have noticed that when it comes to diet, the int...I have noticed that when it comes to diet, the interpretation of the data from the burgeoning field of genetics falls into familiar odeological patterns. Ambiguities tend to be resolved according to one's ideological sensitivities. The vegans and vegetarians see it one way and the meat-eaters see it another. From what I can tell, the classification of Europeans by haplotype is complex and inconclusive as to optimal diet. The best advice for an optimal diet may remain the simplest: don't consume more calories than you can burn, get off your duff and exercise and avoid manmade foods.allisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00035675984343369850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-27300489726489295392012-05-03T06:27:01.667-07:002012-05-03T06:27:01.667-07:00Also most people forget that the biggest source of...Also most people forget that the biggest source of meat comes from trapping. Rabbits, squirrels, birds, hedgehogs are rather abundant and not really difficult to catch. Let's not even start on seafood, musles, oyster, urchins, snails, crayfish, shrimps are really easy to catch (as children we went often to shrimp collecting in the North Sea shores, the most difficult was to get up at 5 in the morning when the tide was low).gallier2https://www.blogger.com/profile/04285836062429366578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-35051915972782783952012-05-03T05:50:43.516-07:002012-05-03T05:50:43.516-07:00Nyx, I'm just bewildered by people who seem to...Nyx, I'm just bewildered by people who seem to think growing food is easy. Even if you do get the soil and water conditions right and get the food growing, you have to put so much effort into keeping the animals out that it makes more sense to eat the animals. They provide more calories per unit of effort. But now that I think about it, perhaps humans did originally grow plant food to use as bait to lure in animals, and then started eating the plants for whatever reason.Don!https://www.blogger.com/profile/05209201919722268057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-19703432626242976772012-05-03T05:06:00.352-07:002012-05-03T05:06:00.352-07:00In a good rainy year, I've seen a geriatric ar...In a good rainy year, I've seen a geriatric arthritic dog catch squirrels. When the animals are that abundant, they're easy prey. Are you suggesting early humans were less adept hunters than a 12-year-old dog? <br /><br />And LOL at just scattering seeds, and birds being easy to chase away. You can just scatter seeds and grow stuff <i>if there's fertile soil and enough water</i>. I've sowed seeds that didn't sprout until years later because there just wasn't enough rain. As for the birds, they're easy enough to chase away <i>if they have abundant food sources elsewhere</i>. If there's not much other food around, they're not going to leave that easily. If you're such a skilled bird whisperer, please, come and help me out so I can maybe get a few figs from my tree this year.Don!https://www.blogger.com/profile/05209201919722268057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-271469772123467432012-05-02T15:41:05.219-07:002012-05-02T15:41:05.219-07:00Just because you adapt to some novel food, it does...Just because you adapt to some novel food, it doesn't follow that you will quickly loose your adaptation to everything that came before.<br />You will likely still be better adapted to the more primal foods as long as they stay in the diet; and animal foods are highly conserved in human diets.<br />Also, you probably don't really need much adaptation to digest foods that dont contain toxins and closely resemble your own body composition.Puddleghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00953398103675945541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-47919517517984775282012-05-01T21:22:54.200-07:002012-05-01T21:22:54.200-07:00>If you have water and fertile soil then there ...>If you have water and fertile soil then there are going to already be lots of plants growing, and there will be lots of animals showing up to eat those plants, so any halfway competent hunter would be able to get some.<br /><br />Have you ever hunted? Most animals are NOT easy to catch. Even today, armed with high-power rifles and scopes and all sorts of other high-tech gizmos, most deer hunters have a hard time bagging a deer. Catching animals with primitive weapons is much more difficult. Meanwhile, even where animals are not hunted, such as national parks, there is usually plenty of plant food for the taking at certain times of years. Berries and nuts, in particular, are extremely abundant in places. Agriculture doesn't neessarily mean using plows and whatnot. It could simply mean burning down some trees and scattering berries seeds and then coming back in a year or two to collect newly growing berries. Dittos for nut trees. Girdle and thus kill the other trees but leave the nut trees alone. Very easy. Wild grains are also abundant in parts of the world. So abundant, that all it takes is a few weeks of work to collect enough to provide food for a year. The competitors for this abundance are birds, which are not always easy to catch, but can be easily chased away.frhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14980384436598923074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-74363304399197701872012-05-01T03:05:25.475-07:002012-05-01T03:05:25.475-07:00@spence193
'..altering the genetics of a food...@spence193<br /><br />'..altering the genetics of a food that is a staple of our society is also altering the adaptive environment, changing the course of evolution, and favoring only those whose immune systems are not sensitized to the new proteins..'<br /><br />If I might make a suggestion, according to my understanding this is not how things work. The gut immune system is organised in such a way that ANY food protein can elicit 'oral tolerance'. Nowadays lots of people are sensitive to one protein or another, and this seems to be because their gut immune system is not working properly and oral tolerance is not established. <br /><br />The oral tolerance system is very complex and the details are still being worked out. Still, it can be said with confidence that the same micronutrients are required for gut immune system health as for the health of any other system. Stripping out the micronutrients from grains is asking for trouble.<br /><br />Have a look at this paper entitled 'Successful oral tolerance induction in severe peanut allergy' to get an idea of how it all works.<br />http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19226304Janehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18175128589806816624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-85470313327693134462012-04-30T21:28:23.530-07:002012-04-30T21:28:23.530-07:00@Don!, I didn't mean to imply that my comments...@Don!, I didn't mean to imply that my comments were particularly well informed, so I'm just speculating out loud. But I could imagine a situation in which first off, people practice a "little bit" of plant cultivation. I think that's fairly common among hunter gatherers. but then maybe they become increasingly reliant upon whatever food that is because other more preferred food becomes less available. as population increases, I would assume that would be the more sought after things, so perhaps we're talking about game animals here. this forces them to rely more upon the cultivated stuff, and to gradually cultivate more and more of it. also, it seems like you would have pressure on their range of territory. if people are living in tribes and there are more tribes, it will be harder to move around as much without running into someone else's territory, so the smaller territory could also create a different kind of pressure, it seems to me. I see that kind of pressure easily incentivizing a people to increasingly try to manipulate the environment they're in, once they are unable to leave it. You have more incentive to try to catch and tie up the animals also if you need to keep them from running into someone else's territory where you cannot pursue them. but I also see power dynamics coming into play as more vulnerable and timid individuals seek protection with stronger more dominant ones and perhaps begin to cultivate specific food items as a kind of tribute. then control of surplus desirable food stuffs becomes a symbol of prestige and power on top of everything else, and presto!Nyxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06307112545023418132noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-83145218250310417032012-04-30T05:06:58.871-07:002012-04-30T05:06:58.871-07:00Was it really the grains that made early farmers l...Was it really the grains that made early farmers less healthy than the hunter gatherers? <br /><br />'This paper examines the puzzle that human beings adopted agriculture independently at least seven and perhaps up to ten times independently in different parts of the world around ten thousand years ago, in spite of the fact that skeletal evidence suggests that the first farmers suffered worse health and nutrition than their hunter gatherer predecessors. It proposes an explanation based on investments in defence, which would have been more necessary for farmers (who being sedentary would have had more resources to defend), but which in turn made them an increased threat to their neighbours. This would have made adoption more attractive among communities whose neighbours had already adopted, leading to a snowball effect of adoption but not necessarily making the first farmers better off than they were before.' <br /><br />http://www.cepr.org/meets/wkcn/1/1626/papers/Seabright.pdfJanehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18175128589806816624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-35948775870715611462012-04-29T21:51:57.309-07:002012-04-29T21:51:57.309-07:00We should address the elephant in the room. The wh...We should address the elephant in the room. The wheat we are consuming today is also genetically different than the wheat man ate 10,000 years ago. Even a difference of a few amino acids can change the way the immune system responds, and is perhaps sensitized, to certain areas of wheat proteins.<br /><br />Just like our genetics have changed, so have the genetics of the plants themselves, a concurrent variable that cannot be ignored, and makes the picture much more complex.<br /><br />Perhaps the problems we are having with wheat today have to do with the genetic modification of these plants. Indirectly, altering the genetics of a food that is a staple of our society is also altering the adaptive environment, changing the course of evolution, and favoring only those whose immune systems are not sensitized to the new proteins.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-24989988154687605362012-04-29T20:05:43.462-07:002012-04-29T20:05:43.462-07:00Having genes from agricultural ancestors doesn'...Having genes from agricultural ancestors doesn't mean you are immune to a celiac disease and doesn't give you a warranty that are not gluten sensitive. If your ancestors ate grains during last 10000 years, does it mean you will not benefit from an Archevore Diet, for example? So far it looks like the populations similar to the Aboriginal people in Australia or Native people in the North America are getting more sick on a Standard Western diet then the people whose ancestors came from Europe, but the difference doesn't mean much for health-considered people.Galina L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09156132815504279615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-22577450108981269232012-04-29T08:32:58.471-07:002012-04-29T08:32:58.471-07:00Hi Stephan,
"...10 Middle Eastern agricultur...Hi Stephan,<br /><br />"...10 Middle Eastern agriculturalists who have been farming for the last 5,000 years come along, teach the hunter-gatherers how to farm, and have children with them."<br /><br />I think we're leaving out some cultural hurdles here that would have made it unlikely that another group could just integrate into another like that. HGs we see now fight for territory and have marked cultural clashes and don't necessary mix this way. The two sides seem to hate each other and each is always claiming the other ruins the first's subsistence strategy. <br /><br />It seems more likely that they fought and one just wiped the other out or at least diminished its numbers enough to marginalize it and leave them no choice but to assimilate or die off.gunther gathererhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15361732213105267048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-76139071305480140312012-04-29T08:29:30.427-07:002012-04-29T08:29:30.427-07:00Thank you for knowledge
grow hair fastThank you for knowledge <br /><a rel="nofollow">grow hair fast</a>คนหลังเขาhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15431573741822312189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-68473442588310973082012-04-29T07:57:08.578-07:002012-04-29T07:57:08.578-07:00It seems to me, on thinking about it, that the arr...It seems to me, on thinking about it, that the arrival of Europeans in the Americas may provide a bit of insight here. Didn't we see that disease wiped out large numbers first, upon first contact. The few who survived the wave of diseases then forced to engage in armed conflict with the new arrivals. Only those that survived all that were around to succumb to dietary, cultural and genetic changes... Doesn't seem to far of a stretch to me that it may have happened similarly in Europe thousands of years before.Skookumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05169976851634738391noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-32036955426269052622012-04-29T07:55:13.359-07:002012-04-29T07:55:13.359-07:00I'm very confused by the scenario a couple of ...I'm very confused by the scenario a couple of commenters seem to be positing. How and why does agriculture arise when resources are scarce? This just isn't making sense to me. <br /><br />If you have water and fertile soil then there are going to already be lots of plants growing, and there will be lots of animals showing up to eat those plants, so any halfway competent hunter would be able to get some. <br /><br />On the other hand, if you <i>don't</i> have water or fertile soil, growing things is going to be extremely difficult, and certainly not something to be undertaken by people who are weak from starvation and/or dehydration. So I can't imagine a scenario in which agriculture would arise - successfully - out of desperation. Can someone elucidate?Don!https://www.blogger.com/profile/05209201919722268057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-4753323555782528892012-04-29T07:10:11.507-07:002012-04-29T07:10:11.507-07:00It's an article of faith to say that it's ...It's an article of faith to say that it's simply elementary that "Natural Selection" necessarily whould have selected for grain consumption amongst European populations. We'd to know the sum and discreet effect(s) of all selection pressures on those populations to even begin to make conclusions as to which of them had any meaningful impact on reproduction. Of course, as Miki points out above, just because you're eating it doesn't mean you ought to. <br /><br />Also, we'd need to account for all political, social and economic factors which could've forced the "obsolescence" of hunter-gatherer genes in those populations. Have a look at the case of European agriculturalists overtaking hunter-gatherers in the Americas. The "selection" - if you will - had far more to do with a patently non-genetic ability to resist small pox and certain strains of influenza than just about any other factor. It's not as though there was clear competition between the genes governing grain tolerance, or any other dietary factor, for that matter.Boomka Musichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08523516117469046292noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-9564980651870994622012-04-29T04:38:37.723-07:002012-04-29T04:38:37.723-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Boomka Musichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08523516117469046292noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1629175743855013102.post-62010529926285417852012-04-28T22:59:26.851-07:002012-04-28T22:59:26.851-07:00That we have genetically adapted to consuming grai...That we have genetically adapted to consuming grains is obvious. We are here to testify. Does this means that consuming plenty of grains contribute to longevity? not really. Evolutionary design is a game of compromises. Our consumption of a large amount of starch is unique in the animal kingdom as the presence of starch in nature is quite rare. It is quite conceivable that we compromised longevity in the process of adaptation to significant starch consumption. Cynthia Kenyon's findings re insulin and longevity hints in this direction.Mikihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01336665212024168702noreply@blogger.com